Jesus Mari Ugalde: "The most practical thing is a good theory"
Jesus Mari Ugalde: "The most practical thing is a good theory"
With this resource, Ugalde has mainly investigated the chemistry of the phosphorus atom cation, but has also studied the chemistry of other systems. It allowed us to hold a conversation with him in a laboratory full of computers.
What is your main line of research?
The main research is theoretical chemistry. Subsequently, this theoretical chemistry is applied or carried out in several lines of research. Theoretical chemistry is not complicated, the experiments are not performed in laboratory but in computer. To do this, it is necessary to feed the computer with different algorithms and appropriate programs.
Do you investigate theoretical systems that cannot be achieved with the computer in the laboratories?
Through these algorithms we simulate many systems. This allows to simulate non-existent conditions in terrestrial laboratories, as well as those existing in terrestrial laboratories.
The study of clouds between stars, for example, is in that. It is very difficult to simulate the physical conditions of these clouds in terrestrial laboratories. But that can be done by computer. Therefore, in these systems, that is, in the interstellar clouds, one can investigate how the chemical processes occur, what reactions occur, how the molecules form, how the atoms react to each other to form molecules.
Then we must verify the results and, among other things, confirm or cancel the results of the theoretical research of the spectra and data that collect different satellites, and of course the theory itself. That's what we've done, focusing on the chemistry of phosphorus. These are the so-called basic reactions of phosphorus.
What have you found? New models of chemical binding?
The model is more of chemical reactions than of chemical links. The chemical links are the same here and in space, they have no big differences, they vary slightly depending on the conditions, but they are basically the same. However, the reaction pathways are very different in terrestrial laboratories and in interstellar clouds.
What we found in this study is bittersweet. In fact, reaction pathways have been found for the synthesis of various molecules with phosphorus associated with nitrogen, as well as for the synthesis of several molecules with carbon-bound phosphorus. But, according to our calculations, we are still not so sure that we have achieved anything good for the molecules that have phosphorus and oxygen together. That is, our calculations do not predict what we have seen in different experiments. For this reason, on the one hand we are studying better what mistakes we have made or what we have forgotten about this model, and on the other hand, several experimentalists are revising their spectra and their experimental evidence because, in short, we have to reach an agreement between both parties.
What is the importance of basic science?
The most practical thing is a good theory. There is no doubt about it. That's the most practical thing, a good theory guides all applications. In our case, finding the right applications is difficult; I at least don't find them. What we do is just a basic science.
Have you been surprised that the society here has rewarded theoretical research?
I am not very good sociologist, I do not pay much attention to sociology. And I don't know exactly what society thinks. In short, what society thinks is the average of what individuals think. But there are many ways to make means, and we must take into account not only the average, but also the scatters, etc. So to say things like this is very dangerous.
I think most people understand that basic science is important. In Euskal Herria there have been several initiatives that have highlighted its importance and this award, together with the Munibe Prize and others, brings this message to society. It requires and is carried out applied research, especially in the technological centers. That framework is fulfilled, and well. But it is also necessary to do a basic research, which is carried out mainly in the university, so it is also necessary to help the university. We must follow the attitude of the Basque Government from its beginnings: we must give our own to basic research and then go on to applied research.
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